Update – Ancestry’s Thru-Lines is serving up this couple as potential ancestors of my Thomas Asher – STILL. People are unwilling to make a change to their Ancestry trees and so now this misinformation is being perpetuated via a DNA tool. Good grief!!!
I have a love/hate relationship with FamilySearch and Ancestry Family Trees. They both allow sloppy genealogy to be perpetuated forever (for heavens sake, Ancestry considers World Family Tree to be a “source”.) And FamilySearch gives free rein to people editing online trees in Wiki fashion without giving the original inputer a chance to approve, enter into a dialogue or comment on the proposed change. Now, I edit on FamilySearch – and I know lots of people who do so carefully, with due diligence, and making sure we include very specific “why this is correct” notes and attaching quality sources. But that kind of contributor is in a minority. And so weird stuff shows up – sometimes repeatedly. Hence this diatribe – and this article. (footnotes are to my sources – ALL the sources for the FamilySearch Family Group are to the various versions of the William Asher and Rhoda Watson marriage record. There are no further sources on FamilySearch.)
FamilySearch Family Group Record for William Asher (LXBX-R6W) and Rhoda Watson(LDBF-MMT)
William born about 1770, Tennessee
Rhoda Watson born about 1774, Tennessee
marriage 5 February 1801, Knox County, Tennessee.
Children:
- Nancy Asher, born about 1802, Tennessee, died 28 May 1860, Howard, Parke County, Indiana, married Joseph Bogue, 10 July 1823, Wayne County, Indiana. 1
- Louisa Asher, born 1803, Tennessee.
- Pennina Asher, born 6 July 1804, Greene County, Tennessee, died 24 December 1879, Masaska County, Iowa, married Nixon Palin 17 May 1820, Wayne County, Indiana.2
- Rebeckah Asher, born about 1805 Tennessee (there is a source attached but the marriage that it references was detached by someone else and I wouldn’t have connected it to this Rebecca anyway so I’m not reinstating it.)
- Thomas Asher born about 1806 Tennessee, Died between 1860-1870 Missouri, married Polly Asher 28 November 1827, Wayne County, Tennessee.3
This isn’t a bad family grouping really, although there is ZERO evidence attaching William and Rhoda to any of these people as their children and there is ZERO evidence of William and Rhoda’s residence in Wayne County, Indiana when the 3 individuals above married there. And of course, there is also ZERO evidence for William and Rhoda ever being in Indiana. But the family grouping of Nancy, Penina and Thomas is reasonable since they all married in Wayne County in a pretty narrow range of time. And despite their ages, they are definitely not the children of Thomas and Sarah (Sumpter) Asher. Thomas and Sarah are the only Asher couple whose presence in Wayne County, at this time, that I have solid evidence for. The Thomas listed above who married Polly is clearly “connected” in some way to the children of Thomas and Sarah (Sumpter) Asher since he moves along similar immigration pathways and appears as a close neighbor on the census several times. And Nancy Asher Bogue belongs to the same church in Wayne County as Sarah Sumpter Asher and her younger daughters. So there are some connections but not sibling connections.
However, the ZERO evidence for William and Rhoda ever living in Wayne County or being in Indiana at all hasn’t stopped a number of people on Ancestry and FamilySearch from conflating them with a William Asher who appears on the 1830 census in Owen County, Indiana and who purchased land in that county earlier. Or from making Rhoda’s William, born 1770 into the son of that William Asher in Owen County who was supposedly born roughly 1797. And that is just plain infuriating. It’s also very sloppy research. (There are also a few folk with a tendency to attach William and Rhoda to the other Owen County Asher – Bartlett. That is also mistaken at least as far as I’ve researched.)
The REAL family of William Asher of Owen County, Indiana – A simple preliminary search of Owen County, Indiana records turns up a skeleton of a family for the William Asher of Owen County. None of these published sources were hard to find – they exist at the FHL, on Ancestry.com (census) and several public libraries and I’m sure they are in the collections of many local genealogical societies as well.
In Section 33 of Jackson Township, Owen County, Indiana there is an Asher Cemetery. Buried in that Cemetery are the following. William Asher 1797-1848. Mary w/o William (other sources state she was born Mary Davis in NC about 1788 died 1865, age 62 on 1850 census.) William B Asher s/o William b. 8 Nov 1815 d 13 April 1879. James W. Asher – no readable dates.4
In the Probate records for Owen County, William’s estate packet lists his heirs as Mary -widow, Lewis- heir, Presley – heir, Allen – heir, Thomas – heir, William – heir, John – heir, Keller – heir. The same records provide evidence that John and Allen, at least, married and lived in Owen County as they are both named with spouse or children in other packets.5
The History of Owen County edited by Charles Blanchard in 18846 gives a full picture of William Asher as an early and active farmer in the town, planting the first orchard in 1832 (moonshiner?) and lists several of his children who are not named in his probate packet, including a son with the extremely unusual name of Arabian Asher. This history also gives a tentative relationship to another Owen County Asher – Solomon who is listed as a brother.
And finally, in the 18307, 1840 8and 18509 censuses of Owen County, William and then Mary Asher are easily found in the company of their neighbors and family.
I haven’t done a full research project on this family. I feel sure that I could put together a strong family group for William and Mary. With some work I think they could be connected to family back in TN. And who knows they might be closely connected to Bartlett Asher of Owen County who is pretty well researched already. This would all take time but it is far from impossible and it would probably be fun. But I am very sure that this family is not closely connected to the Thomas Asher and Sarah (Sumpter) family who have been the focus of my considerable time and research already so I’m not going to do that work. Hopefully someone else will see the absurdity of the online connections and do the work for themselves. Maybe they’ll even see this article and it will give them a head start.
- “Indiana Marriages, 1811-2007,” database with images, FamilySearch (https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:27VL-THG : 10 December 2017), Joseph Bogue and Nancy Asher, 10 Jul 1823; citing Wayne, Indiana, United States, various county clerk offices, Indiana; FHL microfilm 1,838,642. ↩
- “Indiana Marriages, 1811-2007,” database with images, FamilySearch (https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:27VL-Y2X : 10 December 2017), Nixon Palen and Pennina Asher, ; citing Wayne, Indiana, United States, various county clerk offices, Indiana; FHL microfilm 1,838,642. ↩
- “Indiana Marriages, 1811-2007,” database with images, FamilySearch (https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:27VG-97P : 10 December 2017), Thomas Asher and Polly Asher, 28 Nov 1828; citing Wayne, Indiana, United States, various county clerk offices, Indiana; FHL microfilm 1,838,642. ↩
- Owen County, Indiana Cemetery Listings, published by Major Abraham Owen DAR Chapter 1983, pages 97-99 ↩
- Roger Peterson, Index of Significant Names before 1850, Owen County Historical and Genealogical Society, 1995 ↩
- Charles Blanchard, History of Owen County, reprinted (and enlarged) Owen County Historical Society, 1977 ↩
- William Asher household, 1830 Census Wayne and Montgomery Townships, Owen County, Indiana, page 518 ↩
- Mary Asher household, 1840 Census Harrison Township, Owen County, Indiana, page 115 ↩
- Mary Asher household, 1850 Census Jackson Township, Owen County, Indiana, stamped page 53 ↩
I believe that my research takes me to Thomas Alvin? Asher and Sarah “Sally” Sumpter. I would like to verify my charts, any help will be appreciated. Sandy Asher
Sandra – I’m sorry I haven’t been very quick in replying. I would be happy to help if I can. I see that you have given me your email so I will contact you offline.
Greetings,
I am descended from Sarah Asher (and have visited her grave in Vandalia, Iowa, where other of my relatives are buried. I just posted a photo of Manerva Asher Quick and her husband on Find-a-Grave if you happen to be interested in her). I am just beginning to research farther back in this family line now that there is more information online. I can’t afford to keep spending on Ancestry and other pay sites at this point, but if you could share anything you know about Sarah and which Thomas Asher you think is her husband, I would really appreciate it! Thank you!
Sue;
I am happy to help where I can. I have a bit that might be useful. Sarah is definitely Sarah Sumpter – which we get from the obit of Minerva Asher Quick (Manerva is the phonetic spelling apparently the initial I was rounded and drawled a bit leading to an A sound.) We are closing in on her husband as being Thomas Asher born circ 1790 in or near Watagua county NC son of Thomas Asher and Sarah Hix/Hicks. That Thomas had only one full sibling Nancy Asher who married William Crockett (as his second wife) and who died in Carroll County, Indiana. The Sarah Hix connection has been suspected for years but it is difficult to prove. Lots of F.A.N.club research to tie families and associates together in NC, IN, MO and IA. As things become better rounded I will post on the blog. Regarding Sarah Sumpter Asher. She is not, definitely not, descended from the General Sumpter of the Rev. War. He had only 1 son who had no daughters (not sure if he had sons but the timing would be too late for us.) However, the family was very numerous in addition to the “famous” Sumpter so we will eventually connect back to them I suspect. Thomas Asher and Sarah Sumpter married in Wayne County, Kentucky 2 March 1808. What the two families were doing in Kentucky I am not yet sure but many of their F.A.N in Indiana passed from N.C. to Indiana via Kentucky.
I have seen the photo on Find A Grave and it is lovely. You are lucky to have a picture. My Matilda Asher died before photography was really common. I do have a photo of her husband John McLeland in his late 60s holding his youngest son on his knee. They both looked slightly demented in that overly wide-eyed way some early photos have.
Regards
Cousin Heather
I have a William Samuel Asher b. 16 October 1808 according to findagrave. his birthplace of union, Indiana is from Early Reorganization Minutes, 1852-1871, Book A, pp. 349, 394/ Zion’s Ensign Obituaries, 13:21:8/ Early Reorganization Minutes, 1872-1905, Book J on ancestry.com
He and Ardadia Brumage married in Henry County, indiana on 11 Dec 1831. They are living next door to Pennina and Nixon Palin in Oskaloosa, Mahaska, Iowa per 1860 census. *AND* a Rhoda Asher married James Robert Holtzclaw 6 Aug 1816 in Wayne, Indiana, they are on the 1820 census there and have childrens ages that predate the marriage. They are in Henry County on the 1830 census. Madison County in 1840. Findagrave lists her death as 15 Dec 1855 • Richland, Madison, Indiana.
Pennina and Nixon Palin also have ties to Henry County in the 1830s on some quaker meeting records on ancestry.
… so I think the evidence adds up, even though it’s circumstancial…
However, it didn’t take looking very long to rule out the suggestion of the father being the William asher who died in Owen County. The image of the marriage record on ancestry clearly states the Rhoda Watson husband William Asher’s father Was William Asher Senior. https://www.ancestry.com/imageviewer/collections/1169/images/VRMUSATN1780_061338-00672?pId=5004160 (go to 2nd image).
And the William asher in Owen County had a father named Bartlett Asher. https://www.genealogycenter.info/results_pre1882deaths.php
I have seen quite a few Watson families listed in Wayne County records. But i don’t see any mention of a Asher family in that time period. I do not know if she moved there with siblings or cousins or? Or if her 1st husband William ever went there at all. I am also not certain if my William Samuel ‘s birthplace of union, indiana is accurate, or if it referred to a city or county as far as looking for a lead on where Rhoda and/or William were in 1810.
Dawna
Thanks for commenting. The Henry County to Iowa connection is strong for the Asher family – there are several families who move along that path – both Ashers and their connected families. But that doesn’t connection your William Samuel Asher to William and Rhoda sadly. The Rhoda Asher who married James Robert Hotlzclaw is originally from North Carolina/Tennesse border area and the odds are given her marriage that she is one of the descendants of the Asher Family of the Watagua Valley. William Samuel Asher might be connected to that family as well. Pennina is an Asher before marriage but I have never been able to firmly place her.
Sadly I don’t this the William Asher in Owen County was a son of Bartlett Asher – despite that various trees that connect them. BUT I’ve not really done deep research on Barlett’s family. He left plenty of records – land, probate etc. But William Asher is a crazily common name in southern Indiana and in NC/TN area. So sorting them out requires tons of digging and frankly I have other families I need to concentrate on now.
Union is in Pike County and wasn’t settled until 1845 so he was unlikely to have been born there in 1810. The area that became Pike County in 1816 was still very sparsely settled in 1808 although it was growing quickly, and it was part of Knox County until 1816. It is in the far western part of Indiana so very disconnected with Henry and Wayne Counties geographically. Union County wasn’t created until 1821 but in 1810 it also was part of Knox County and it was cut off from part of Wayne County. The first nonnative settlers in the area were from South Carolina. So if you are trying to connect him to William and Rhoda then they should be in Knox County or possibly in Wayne County which was created from Knox in 1810.